Grant Smith on Hendrix, Elvis and Saturday’s Gig

Lisa McDonald wraps up her enormously entertaining in-depth interview with Canadian R&B legend, Grant Smith today. Lisa knows what questions to ask, and brokers a lively interview with whoever she has in her sights. Please feel free to add your comments after you read this interview, Lisa will appreciate the feedback. This final installment of  the Grant Smith Interview holds many surprises, chuckles and thoughtful anecdotes. To read the earlier installments … Part One, Part Two, and Part Three can be accessed by clicking on the respective links.

The Grant Smith Interview with Lisa McDonald Part Three

Grant Smith has been in the entertainment business for more than 45 years.  Starting out in 1964 as a rock and roll drummer with The Missing Links, it wasn’t long before Smith found himself fronting his own band, a 7-piece R&B act called The Power.  Grant Smith and the Power ripped up Toronto’s club circuit with their high energy sold-out shows throughout the years of 1967-1970.  By the middle of the decade, Smith had rubbed shoulders with many of the iconic 60s rock stars known to all of us today.  Along with securing an MGM recording contract, Smith starred, directed and co-produced Red White and Hot!, a Vegas-style variety show featured at the 1988 Calgary Winter Olympics.  With a life-long talent for painting, this multi-media artist produced and acted in television movies, hosted the Miss Teen Canada Pageant and Jerry Lewis Muscular Dystrophy telethon, and made several appearances on everything from the Tommy Hunter Show to the Juno Awards.  Spending considerable time in Las Vegas, Mr. Smith has worked as a singer for jingle writers, as a choreographer and as an entertainer landing him numerous return engagements to Caesars Palace.  Currently, Grant Smith has been on double duty writing his first novel and wrapping up his latest film project, a documentary exploring the phenomenon of the Elvis Presley fan.  Mr. Smith joins me now to discuss not only his upcoming Soul’d Out show at the Estonia House on Nov 14^th, but to tell me fascinating and often hilarious stories of all the celebrities he met along the way….

The Grant Smith Interview continues…

Have you met James Brown?

Yes.

Really?!  Oh, do tell!  I love James Brown!

The first time I played with James Brown there was racial tension between me and his band.  He was surrounded by guys who were jealous of success.  They came from places of poverty.  They were very protective.  If there was a common dressing room, it was their dressing room.  James Brown was a nice guy, but the first time I talked to him, I couldn’t understand one word the man said. (laughs)

Ha!  Was he drunk?

No, but he spoke very fast with a heavy Georgia accent.  He was probably a little buzzed on something, but he wasn’t drunk.  It was funny though.  I laughed over it many times.

When and where was this?

It would have been nineteen seventy something at Glen Park Inferno in Buffalo.  I played six nights a week to about 200 people in their small room.  On the weekend, I would move into the bigger room and open up for the bigger acts.  I met Brown in his dressing room during intermission.  When he was around white people he was slightly easier to understand but, when he was with his entourage you couldn’t understand any of them.  James Brown smoked that audience of white college kids.  He just smoked ‘em! I also played with Parliament Funkadelic when they were still called the Parliaments.  Back before they dropped acid (laughs) to become the Funkadelics!  Back when they did nice choreography, and wore suits.

What was George Clinton like?

He was a good cat.  When I first worked with them they dressed in Todd’s Men’s Wear.  All the black acts dressed in slick looking suits back then.  Smokey Robinson and The Miracles were exactly the same.  Patent-leather shoes to go with the hair, and suits.

But perhaps it’s not always the acid that changes the image.  What about the Elvis Presley syndrome?  You give a poor boy a million dollars and you can sit back and watch his attire rapidly escalate to the outrageous.

I am so infused with Elvis lore right now.  I’ve been working on a documentary for three years.  After hearing about the Collingwood Elvis festival, I we went there to shoot some footage.  I had no idea what we’d get but, the festival has been getting bigger and bigger every year and the media has been noticing it.  So why wouldn’t I want to document it?  In my usual subtle way I marched into the festival office and spoke to the person in charge.  I told him I wanted backstage access and I got it.  With no script it was what you would call a Rambo shoot.  But we finally have the thing composed now and the nitty gritty of the final edit has begun.  I’m editing from 40 hours of interviews.  Having it broadcast on television could make me serious money but, it will likely go straight to dvd.  You can view being Grant interviewed at the Collingwood Elvis Festival here.

So you’re a filmmaker too!  But why Elvis?  Hasn’t everything been
documented on Elvis already?  Are you a big Elvis fan?

No.  I’m just a curious guy.  The film is about the Elvis fan, the phenomenon of the Elvis fan.

Did you have to secure rights and permissions from the Elvis estate?

Elvis Presley Enterprises took control of the Collingwood Elvis Festival.  And when they heard about my documentary, they sent me a cease and desist letter.  But there’s nothing of Elvis in this film, other than what people say.

Incredible.  I don’t know how Elvis Presley Enterprises controls it all.  It must be an enormous task.  Elvis is everywhere!

I spoke to a copyright lawyer.  I’m told we have nothing to worry about.  But nonetheless, I’m putting a warning message at the beginning of the doc which says, “the following program contains scenes which are Pelvis in nature”.  (laughs)  I became fascinated by the Elvis fan when I met Presley in Vegas.

You met the King of Rock and Roll?  Oh my god, I don’t think I’ve ever met anyone who’s met Elvis Presley before!

Well there’s not much to tell.  It was just a handshake.  Back in the 70s, the entertainment director at Caesars Palace took me to watch his show from the tech booth.  I looked at Elvis as a charismatic guy who was a good entertainer.  And one thing Elvis would do is head to the casino after the show.  Not to gamble but to just walk through for PR and photo opportunities.  You know, a shot of him leaning on the crap table, or something like that.

There must’ve been 50 people surrounding him as he walked through!  How was he dressed?

Not fifty, but there were many in his entourage.  He looked just like Elvis would; wearing leather and a high collar.  The casino would be jammed with people waiting for him to stroll through.  While they waited, they’d gamble.  It was all part of the casino culture.  And the buzz he created was absolutely amazing.  I was introduced to Elvis as “Grant Smith from Canada, and he works here”.

So what did his handshake feel like?  Did you feel the weight of the rings on his fingers?

I don’t really remember much, but he did have rings on.  It was a good handshake.  Elvis looked me in the eye, smiled, and said, “pleased to meet you”.  He was a good looking guy, but up close I could tell he had acne when he was younger.  The meeting was very brief.  Over the years, I became more and more amazed over the Elvis fan and how they came in all shapes and sizes; like the Jewish lawyer with a painting of Presley on his office wall.  Or the Elvis fan with all the records spewing endless Elvis trivia.  Truck drivers, letter carriers, doctors and doctors who live in Japan are all Elvis fans.  It’s amazing.  There are three English phrases that are apparently known all over the world:  Jesus Christ, Coca Cola and Elvis Presley.  It’s that widespread.

I realized the Elvis of today is totally whitewashed and a sterilized version of what he once was.  Elvis Presley has taken on a religious reality.  I captured footage of a woman with a shrine in her bedroom.  She has an alter with pictures of Jesus but in the centre is a photo of Elvis.  It’s actually Presley’s face photo shopped on the body of someone else, dressed in robes with a halo.  She says Elvis is the intermediary when she prays to God.  She believes Elvis can speak to God on her behalf.   She told me, “Elvis was such a good person, a holy person.  Elvis led a perfect life.  He donated to hundreds of charities.  And the problems he had in life and the reason he died was because he gave so much to his fans.”

Didn’t it make you crazy listening to this?

I don’t wish to denigrate the Elvis fan; I just want to show what it is.  Some people I asked said, “I don’t want to be interviewed if you’re going to make me look like a freak.”  And there was an agonizing decision I had to make over one guy I interviewed.  He was an obese guy with emphysema, diabetes and oxygen tubes in his nose.  His house was full of Elvis paraphernalia; Elvis key chains, Elvis watches, Elvis lunch boxes, Elvis blankets, Elvis towels and he knew every bit of minutia on Elvis.  He knew the address of every place Elvis ever lived; he knew Elvis’ teachers and friend’s names and he even knew Elvis’ father’s boss’ name!

And we wonder why Elvis is dead!

I spent two hours interviewing this guy in his house while his wife waited in the kitchen.  She would only come out occasionally, but I was getting bad vibes from her.  She was very protective of him and she really didn’t want me there.  After the interview was done, well, he died.  And his wife tracked me down to ask me not to use his interview in the documentary.  It was too embarrassing for his family, and she didn’t trust me to use her husband in a sensitive way.  It was an agonizing decision but, I told her I wouldn’t use it.  It’s too bad.  It was unbelievable stuff.  There’s a property manager in Niagara Falls who summed it up perfectly.  He said, “the thing about the Elvis phenomenon is everyone has their own Elvis.  You’ve got your Elvis, he’s got his Elvis and I have my Elvis and they’re all different.  The most important thing is, we can get together and share the good feelings our individual Elvis’ bring to us, in a communal way.”  I thought this was a good take on it.  I also found that the majority of Elvis fans, whether male or female, said it was their father that first turned them on to Elvis.  Not one of the people I interviewed said they were introduced to Elvis by their mother, or brother or sister.  I found this interesting. Wait till you see the documentary.  It’s amazing.  It’s got all the necessary things for a religious movement; artifacts, precious relics, shrines, pilgrimages, preachers and disciples.

Have you made other films?

Yes, I did a documentary on a young kick boxer who became a world champion.  I also produced his champion fight at an arena and got it played on TSN.

Compared to show business in the 60s and 70s, what are your thoughts on music today and are you surprised by the implosion of the record industry?

It’s hard for me to comment on music today.  It’s like standing on the outside looking in.  I don’t really listen to today’s music.  I find it boring.  But then again, the singers on some of those shows like American or Canadian Idol are tremendous singers.  I think I like it because the songs chosen for them are old R&B songs.  They’re singing good songs because people are choosing older songs for them to sing.

Not so much different from what record companies did back in the 50s and 60s.

But I don’t feel qualified to pass judgment on today’s music, because I’m not of it.  It doesn’t resonate with me.  Very seldom do I listen to music anyway, unless it’s task-specific.  When I’m at home, I’m constantly writing.  I get up 15 times during an evening to scribble down a line.  I think my writing has music to it.  My prose has beats and flows and movement and it has to sound good in my head when I read it.  A lot of times I’ll re-write something to get the sound right.  I don’t have my own editor but, at some point I’ll have to deal with getting one.  It’ll be terrible though, being I’m so strong-willed.

There are many musicians who don’t go out and support their own.  If you don’t listen to music around the house, do you go out to see music in your community?

I like the Chick n Deli. It’s an older crowd and I can hear music there from my era.  I don’t go out much, but the Deli is a few blocks from my house.  And Robbie Lane likes to get me up to sing a few.  There’s really only one reason musicians don’t go out to support each other.  It’s economic.  They can’t afford it.  Through my career, there were always places I could play, six nights a week.  I was at the top of the heap of whatever heap I was in.  There were a lot of opportunities and I always made great money.  Bands today play for nothing, or they play for the door.  As a result, they can’t afford much.  In my day, Toronto had more live gigs than any city in North America.  We had Paul Shaffer working at the Bermuda. The music business is in a terrible place right now but I think this is good in some ways.  I think we will return to the old values.  It’s cyclical.  It’s got very insular with musicians making and selling music from computers and marketing their music from computers.  But if you don’t get feedback from an audience, it’s like masturbation sitting at your computer.  Your friends will always tell you it’s good, but you have to perform in front of people who don’t know you.  For my Estonia House show coming up, I’m dealing with the current reality as well.  It’s not an easy sell, and I’ll be out putting posters up myself.  I don’t mind.  This is my baby and I’ll make it fly.  But the music business will re-invent itself because it’s an innate part of the human condition to have music, to perform music and to listen to music.  It may have seemed like our salvation at the beginning, but when music moved to the internet, the quality got lost.  It’s shit content now.  It all sounds the same.  It’s homogenized.  And the record producer is the star.  Not because he’s producing good music but, he’s making the deals to get the music out there.  Greed was the number one reason the industry fell apart.

The best way to satisfy greed is to take things down to the lowest common denominator, so you can sell more units.  And doing that will destroy the artistic content of anything.  If profit is the prime motivation in any industry, it will eventually self-destruct.  I’m glad to see that you’re actually there Lisa.  I’ve talked to other people and they don’t see it.  Listening to you I can tell what drives your creativity.  I find you have a collection of knowledge on the music scene and I’m sure you could have a wide ranging conversation, artist specific.  A lot of other people could have the same knowledge but they don’t do anything with it.  Here you are, turning it into something.

True artists making quality music is what I think will turn this around.  But there’s so much stuff out there, it’s not always easy to find the quality.

For my show at the Estonia House, it won’t be just a night of acts doing a set and then another set and another set.  That’s actually what’s going to happen but, I have as much concern over how good the meal is, how good the lighting is, and how clean the washrooms are, as I do over the music.  It will be a total experience.  It will be an occasion.  I try to think of all the ways to make sure everyone who leaves at the end of the night will be saying, “what a great night.  I had a great time!”  This is what it’s all about for me.  It’s always been my mantra.  I need to pay attention to all the details, to make sure everything is just right.  I always have to achieve this level to maintain my enthusiasm for it.

Hearing you say this really appeals to me.  I don’t know how many shows I’ve been to where the music may be at the level of quality I expect, but the door person will be rude, the bartender will ignore me and the washrooms will have no toilet paper and none of the hand driers work.  I hate that.

Anybody who’s rude in my camp is gone.  The only person who can be rude is me.  But if somebody makes me rude, they’ve really accomplished something.   And then, they’re gone.

Greed may have destroyed the business but I also think the industry played a role in destroying some of the artists.  Look at Jimi Hendrix for instance.  From what I’ve read, Hendrix could never say no.  I think he was taken advantage of by the record companies and, just like so many other artists, this helped lead to his death.

I don’t think anybody should blame another person for what happens to them.  Ultimately, you are your own responsibility.  I’ve been through drugs myself.  I’ve done every drug imaginable but, I would have done drugs whether I was in show business or stock car racing.

But you’re not as easy to take advantage of.  People like Jimi Hendrix and Janis Joplin were.  They’d let themselves be taken advantage of, and then go off and drink themselves to death. The music business should take some responsibility for that.

Jimi Hendrix was a death waiting to happen.  I tell ya, I never saw anyone take as much as acid as Jimi Hendrix.

You’ve met Jimi Hendrix too!

Yes, when I was playing Trudy Heller’s.  Trudy Heller’s was a really expensive and exclusive place in New York City.  Normal people did not go there.   The audience consisted of fucked up sons and daughters of wealthy people who had nothing better to do but get as stoned as they possibly could.  It was that slice of life that people used as an example of what was wrong with America.

It was one of those places that always made the society pages… “so and so was seen at Trudy Heller’s”.  But one night when I was working there, a couple of groupies came in.  They talked endlessly about how close friends they were with some famous people.  Of course I thought they were full of shit but, when they invited me and another guy from my band back to their apartment to get high, I didn’t care if they were friends with celebrities or not.  I wanted to get high, have a few drinks, and maybe get a little nooky nooky (laughs).  Whatever!  So when we get back to their apartment, which is a fabulous old brown stone right at Central Park, we start getting totally smashed on hash.  Then the girls tell us Jimi and Noel Redding are coming over.  The only reason I knew they were talking about Jimi Hendrix was because of Noel Redding.  And I thought, yea okay sure, they’re coming over, right.  We continue drinking and getting totally smashed when, ding dong!  And in walks Noel Redding and Jimi Hendrix!

Oh my god.  What was your first impression?

I really did think the girls were bullshitting, but when they walked in, I wasn’t star struck.  Jimi looked exactly like he stepped off his album cover, with his big hat, fur vest and rings.  And Noel Redding had this huge afro.  They introduced themselves, sat down, and then Jimi brings out a folded piece of paper with tons of acid on it.  Now, I was always a cautious guy so when Hendrix passed the acid around, I split my hit in two and only took half.  Hendrix took two.  Time, as well as acid has warped some of my memory but, it didn’t seem like very long after when Hendrix asked if we wanted more. I watched Hendrix take six hits of acid.  I was getting off pretty good with just half a hit and Hendrix took six hits of acid in an hour, or maybe it was an hour and a half.  And he still looked the same.  He didn’t change at all!

He didn’t get excited and start talking a lot?

No.  He just laid back.  He didn’t say much. (laughs)

Weird.  Were the girls crawling all over him?

Nope.  Everybody was just really stoned.  Music was playing.  But I kept staring at him.   I just kept staring at him in disbelief that he took six hits of acid!  It was strong acid.  It was psychedelic.  But he never really changed.  I changed (laughs).  I hallucinated.   But I can’t recall anything remarkable happening.

Hendrix didn’t pull out his guitar and start wanking it right there in front of you?! (laughing)

I started getting fucked up.   After three or four hours, I left.  But ya know what?  I saw Hendrix perform when he was still Little Richard’s guitar player.  The reason I remember him was not just because he played left-handed and played it upside down.  What I remember about Hendrix at that time was… he wore a suit.

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About Lisa McDonald: “I’m a city girl. A vegetarian who enjoys yoga, pilates, and cycles to keep active but live music is my real passion. All things music really, and I’ve been known to write about it.. I value a strong work ethic and good manners, but what really turns me on is confidence and experience.”