The Saga of Steve Negus – Part 2

Lisa McDonald is back with Part Two of her interview with Steve Negus. Lisa knows what questions to ask, and brokers a lively interview with whoever she has in her sights. Please feel free to add your comments after you have read this interview as Lisa appreciates any and all feedback.

The Steve Negus Interview Part Two

By Lisa McDonald

Do you enjoy working in the studio?

I love studio work.  I’m as comfortable in the studio as I am on stage.  They do different things for me, but I like them both equally.  Being in the studio can be tedious, but it’s where you take your ideas and develop them.  You have to put in the time to get the essence of the song out.  It doesn’t just come with playing the chords, at least not for me.  With my music, it’s like writing for orchestras with elements and counter melodies and all this subtle stuff going on.  You’ll hear new stuff in the arrangements even after listening to it a hundred times.

Langlade is also the vocalist in the Negus band, along with Kelly Kereliuk on guitar, Ian Nielsen on bass and Matt Whale on keyboards. Will fans be hearing strictly Negus originals at your shows, or do you also perform material from Saga?

What I’m doing at my shows is a compilation of all the history we’ve talked about.  I’m doing a Fludd song, a Chris DeBurgh song, and although we did In Your Eyes at one show, we haven’t been doing any GNP.  I’m hoping to have Ed Pilling come out and do What an Animal, one of Fludd’s big hits.  And of course we’re doing Saga stuff.  We take Saga tracks, and give them slightly different twists to see how it feels in the show.  We change it up to find a nice mix.

When I was re-visiting Saga songs prior to this interview, I thought my god, I know all these songs.  I know all the words! (laughter) And I was reminded just how many hit songs you had.  And not only the songs, but Saga had many videos playing on television.

Saga came out right at the time when MTV was breaking.  MTV showed our videos to death because there weren’t that many to show at the time.  Saga was touring the States extensively with Pat Benatar, Billy Squire, Heart, and Jethro Tull.  By playing our videos regularly, MTV really helped break us in America.

For years now, Canadian artists have to go to the United States to make a name for themselves.  I think it’s still that way.  Saga not only toured the States, but became huge in places like Puerto Rico.  What are your thoughts not only on the Canadian music industry today but the music business in general?

Most Canadian artists have to go someplace else to be successful.  I think its part of the Canadian psyche.  We have this thing in our head, an inferiority complex.

We need somebody else, other than a Canadian, to tell us we’re good?

Exactly.

I grew up thinking that.

Of course you did.  Until somebody else accepts it, it’s just Canadian so it can’t be good.  Now, this is the problem that all Canadian artists, including myself, are still having.  There is very little support from Canadian communities and with the collapse of the music industry, we’re now faced with situations whereby most bands can’t afford to play.  This brings us to The Collective, which George (Roche) and I want to talk about.

George Roche, manager of Steve Negus and Executive Producer of Lucid Productions joins the conversation.

GR: In order to get the notoriety and recognition originally brought about by the record companies, musicians now have to rely on their own pragmatic skill.  With record companies looking after it, bands didn’t need to hone their own business skill or be required to manage the manager.  Bands only had to get to sound check on time.  Due to the advent of the internet and the inauguration of Youtube, the record industry has imploded.  The artist now has to wear all the hats.  Artists have to rely on their own resources to bring their music to the field.  And the internet and Youtube are mediums that even the record companies now say bands have no choice but to use.  But how do we compensate the artist fairly?  This is the biggest glitch.  It’s amazing that the current mindset has no guilt and no shame whatsoever of going on line and accessing Steve’s or anyone’s music for free.  It wasn’t long ago you’d be sued for this.

SN: Performing live is the only real source of revenue left for musicians.  And I think in order to make it a healthy environment again, we have to go back to a grass roots level and build an audience from there.

Online social networking sites like Facebook and Myspace are very powerful and many of us like using them to promote music. It’s the first and foremost reason I use them.  But the market is saturated and I’m not altogether sure if these sites are being used effectively.

GR: The internet is helping to build our team in ways that were never possible before.  Years ago you couldn’t find people as easily as we can find them now.  You had to know someone who knew someone who knew someone.  Now you can find people on Facebook with the click of a mouse.  Technology has worked against the industry but there are also many ways to benefit by it.  However, let’s take it one step further.  The results people will experience will only come from what’s been properly stated.  Word of mouth is only as effective as the communication style being used to elicit a response.  If the communication style is ineffective, word of mouth in itself is just another ineffective tool.  The formulation of the communication strategy is the beginning.  Lisa, remember when we were on the phone?  Afterward you sent me an email to say “what a great conversation we were having, too bad my phone died”.  Think about that for a minute.  It’s the inspiration from that kind of conversation that keeps us here.  Get that interesting conversation going and the market will listen.  But if it’s the same old hat and repetition of the old ways, you’re done.  It’s got to be a new pitch, a new way of thinking, a new conversation. And when people feel that newness, it will motivate them to action.  It’s all about the emotional.  Yea! Yea! Yea!  It’s about taking the necessary steps that are congruent to the current climate requirements. I still got musicians saying, I’m a fucking rock star, where’s my guarantee?” I argue with them on the phone saying, “If you’re looking for a guarantee, you’re stuck in the ’80′s” It’s lad, follow, or get out of the way.

The Grateful Dead who based their entire 40-year career on the live experience and building their fan base from a grass roots level, have the most loyal and dedicated fans on the planet.  And it’s still going strong.  But at the same time, the late Jerry Garcia was quoted as saying, “the music should be free”.

GR: The Grateful Dead were future-proofed years ago.  Bands back then were applauded for releasing independently.  Challenge the machine!  Say no to the record companies!  This showed character and heart.  You were courageous to be able to do this and you were applauded. But these are not the times for sticking your tongue out at the people who were once feeding the industry.  If you can’t afford to produce your own material now, you’re not going to get it released independently or otherwise.  If you take an independent working band who gigs twice a month, in the end that band will have incurred over $100 per gig related to gas, cell phone bills, media, graphic work and equipment rental expenses. Most are out of pocket before they hit the stage and probably will lose money.  Not to mention those bands that have members who hold down jobs, who don’t have the time to invest in performing the tasks necessary to effectively market and advertise their act. In any case, that’s $1200 per year to a band playing six months of that year, and it’s pale in comparison to what it would cost to market a band using more aggressive strategies. No matter who you are, the question is “where are your followers and how many are showing up?”

SN: When I tried to get the Negus band out to play, I couldn’t find an agent.  All the agents are booking these days are tribute bands.  It’s the tribute bands that are making money.  But by only booking tribute bands, the club owners and agents are destroying original music.  Agents laughed at me when I said I wanted to book my original band.  “ha, ha… sorry, I just booked an Abba tribute this week”.  I don’t want to play in a tribute band.

GR: Its robbery compared to say, Germany, where the music scene has always been very proactive.  Germans have their own music outside of the international stuff.  Every fourth song on the radio has to be German and be sung in German.

But Canada does have their own music and our radio stations are regulated for Canadian content.

SN: But where do they get it from?  Years ago it was Gordon Lightfoot and Anne Murray and I guess now Saga fits into that as well.  You’ll hear Wind Him Up and On the Loose but they don’t get their Canadian content from new artists, only from Canadian gold.   This has been going on for years.  It’s the old Canadian way of just playing it safe.

Okay, so who exactly is The Collective and how will they make the difference?

GR: The Collective are willing to address the issues most want to ignore.  Nothing will change unless it’s acknowledged.  Many have accepted the mediocrity as if there’s no other solution.  What it comes down to is the strength of any one initiative and the amount of people who buy into it.  One or two people can’t change the world.  The strength of the numbers will be realized by people who get the thinking.  We can only conquer the conquerable by working with the workable.  Whoever is interested in seeing a change, will want to take risks and get outside the box, and not live in this mediocre comfort zone.  By staying in the box, we stagnate and stunt our growth.

SN: To answer your question more specifically, The Collective is artists, photographers, video people, journalists, you, marketing, management, agents, promoters, and everyone else on the credits.  What we have to realize is, without each other we have nothing.  We have to pull together, pool our resources and donate our services, so that we have some power to get out there and perform.

When you say donate services, do you mean donate money?

SN: No, it’s not about donating money.  Bands are going to clubs and asking “can I get a gig here?”, and the club owners are telling them “give me 1200 bucks, bring the audience and market it, and you can have a gig here”.  This is not easy to do, but if everyone involved in the field combines their efforts, The Collective  can promote, take care of sound, the lights, the door, and whatever else needs to be done. We can do this ourselves! We’ll pack the place and the club can have the bar.  Most of The Collective will work for, if not nothing, next to nothing, at least as we develop and build our team.  Eventually the money will come to get paid for our services.

GR: Club owners would have no reason to say no because we’ve solved their problems.  And we’re not looking for the guarantee.  We believe with the skills, experience, knowledge and efforts of dedicated people, we won’t need the guarantee.  It doesn’t make sense to leave everyone in a segregated position when we’re all vying for the same attention, the same market, and utilising the same resources.  Everyone may as well be brought on line to better the pragmatic game board.  One of the biggest problems out there right now is the disconnection with relationships.  It all has to get harmonized.  The Collective is the answer but it has to be credible.  It will really come down to credibility.  I personally cannot stand seeing a stage wasted on Mustang Sally.  It drives me up the wall.  I don’t want to knock the guys who are out there playing Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl, but I want The Collective to be about the dedication and commitment found in creativity.

But really, how will this be any different?  How will you prevent the egos that led to the greed that caused the collapse of the music business to begin with?

GR: We’ll be running it, and we’ll have the decision making powers to say….

But that sounds like another record company to me.

GR: But with record companies you didn’t have a choice.  The negativistic way which took over the industry is a learned way of thinking.  This psychology needs to be addressed.  It comes from being conditioned by negative messages sent by those running the businesses.  We need people desirous of change.  But there’s no point in pitching a monkey on this if he doesn’t understand the language.  We’re going to start with the people who already get it, and bring them on line.  They will become the foot soldiers and the teachers. I think that’s what it will take.  We need the role models to restore the integrity on this thing.  With The Collective, bands come and we audition them.  We’ll have competent people looking at the skills of the band.  If they’re not up to the standards of the Collective, we’ll send them to the amateur division at The League of Rock, for example (see LOR website link at the end of the article). Terry Moshenberg at the League of Rock provides an environment where bands can find out if being a professional musician is something they’re really up for and really want to do.

Little Steven (Van Zant) says a band only gets good by playing covers.  A band has to play in a bar six nights a week, paying their dues, before they’ll ever be any good.

GR: But you know what happens?  When you’re done with those bars, the majority of bands don’t make it back.  The majority!  Clubs are scrutinizing and they’re very prejudicial.  It doesn’t matter how good you are, the club only cares about the bottom line.  Bands then have to go find new venues to play in.  We want to keep everyone at the same level.  But there has to be some integrity.  There has to be dedication and commitment on the band’s part.  The ID cards The Collective hands out will be indication enough.  When clubs see our card, it will say, “oh this guy has been approved by a body of people who want to put out good music”.

SN: There are also phenomenal photographers who we’ve made part of our team.  These photographers would be made available to not just my band, but for all who join The Collective.  It will enable us to better do what we do, just as it does for you as a journalist.  As a journalist for example, by joining the Collective, we could feed you new artists as it grows, and you could write about it.  It’s a win-win situation.

Looking at stadium shows these days, I don’t know how much longer music fans will continue dishing out money for the ticket prices they’re charging.  It’s been on the decline for a while I think, yet if Live Nation and Ticketmaster merge, live music may only be experienced by the elite class.

GR: I won’t buy from Ticketmaster.  But isn’t it interesting?  Ticketmaster are seeking their next of kin to work with, just as musicians are.  I talk with all kinds of managers and we benefit largely from our exchange of information and our own findings, which in many ways can be serendipitous, ya know?

Bob Lefsetz, the industry guy who goes on and on about the need for this kind of change has very strong opinions which caused a heated debate with Gene Simmons at the Royal York Hotel during the last Canadian Music Week in Toronto.  Lefsetz argued that Simmons’ new record label will take off initially because of the Simmons name, but ultimately it will fail because he uses the old model. I guess you both agree with Lefsetz?

GR: Anything Gene Simmons touches turns to money.  He’s Gene.  But once we figure out what the communicative words are going to be, The Collective spiel will be what moves people. It cannot be the same message.  If you’re going to survive in the Canadian music industry, you have to be proactive, pro-social, and do it deliberately.  What’s going to happen?  Are the clubs going to become extinct?  Are we going to shut down the entire industry because there won’t be any places left to play?  Will there be a rebellion?  If we don’t get control of this thing now, that could very well happen.  Interestingly, entertainment revenue is the second thing central to the local economy.  Most people don’t realize it.  If you get a divorce, entertainment expenses are on the table as a legitimate expense.  But what I’ve learned is Canada is very apathetic.  I think we’ve been trained to be.  People treat you the way you teach them how to.  The negativistic business practices that have run the industry has led us to apathy and stagnation.  There’s so much distrust and so many people getting screwed.  How can anyone think about what they can do for the Canadian music industry when all that’s on their mind is the next guy who’s gonna fuck them? This is not the state of mind to be pro-active, pro-social, a planner, a contributor, or a team mate!  The power has been placed in the wrong laps for many years.  Power should be shifted to the people actually doing the work, the hands-on people.

Is the Collective open to all genres of music?

GR: It’s about matching the right resource with the right opportunity.  I just did sound for Walter Ostanek on the weekend.  I added him to the list because I realize there could be blue hairs down the road who want to hear polka!

Is the Collective an established entity right now? Will it require registration?

GR: You’re talking TMA.  The Toronto Musician Association was a sham.  They offered legal advice and they offered a lot of things to the artists who paid membership money, but TMA delivered nothing.  Any situation I ever heard of where the TMA was involved, claims were never delivered upon.  I think it fizzled out when artists stopped paying their dues.  Tragically, our own government doesn’t seem to know how to build legislation to defend our artists and their material, but they have that protection and legislation firmly in place for the film industry, don’t they? One of the focuses of The Collective will be to address those issues with a united front on matters. It’s time to really begin utilizing our resources to promote a quality of life within the music industry that doesn’t exist right now. In my view, for that to be achieved, everyone must agree that we are all in the same boat and, if that boat tips over, we ALL get wet. A partnership is not about one person having a better chance at profit than anyone else involved. That’s greed. The Collective is about fairness and equality. The ME! ME! ME! has got to go. It’s back to grass roots.  “You work for me” has been edited to “we are working together.”

SN: I think if we all work together, we’ll all win.  We won’t be dealing with a cultural wasteland.

http://www.stevenegus.com/

http://www.myspace.com/thelucidproductions

http://www.myspace.com/sagaca

http://www.leagueofrock.com/

About Lisa McDonald: “I’m a city girl. A vegetarian who enjoys yoga, pilates, and cycles to keep active but live music is my real passion. All things music really, and I’ve been known to write about it.. I value a strong work ethic and good manners, but what really turns me on is confidence and experience.”